At first, Avimor will have to ship its sewage - but where to? : comments

Return to At first, Avimor will have to ship its sewage - but where to?

Avimor is a bad idea,

and the City of Boise has every right to refuse their sewage. Good job Mayor Bieter!

Avimor should deliver the sewage to Judy Peavey Derr and the other Commissioners (their names escape me but I remember one cheats on his taxes), because they voted to authorize this sprawl.

That Avimor had the temerity to think Boise would subsidize their development is nothing short of astounding.

I don't think there is any subsidy involved

I'm pretty sure the city charges to accept sewage. But you would have to actually read the article to know that.

Indirect, not direct subsidy

If Boise or someone else accepts the sewage it's an indirect subsidy because it delays the time prior to when Avimor gets around to building their own treatment plant. Any delay in their capital/infrastructure costs at our expense provides a subsidy to the Avimor developers because they can put off their expenses to another day. Certainly there would be no direct subsidy if Boise's fee for service also covers system development costs (which Boise is very good at with new hook-up fees). But you did not provide any information to verify that.

Avimor has built a sewer plant

It's the first thing you see on the right hand side of the road coming out of the canyon after shadow valley. I think that they just need enough volume to make it run correctly. Sewer plants can be tricky devils.

All of the reclaimed water from Avimors sewer plant goes to water common areas in Avimor.

Call in the Lawyers

Avimor/SunCor has had a team of Hawley Troxell Lawyers at their beck and call and in their pockets for several years now. Since the lawyers are so proud of this little project and all the accidents and congestion that the construction has caused and the housing project will no doubt create, let them solve this little sewer problem as well.

Jess Hawley must be rolling over in his grave.

Crap flows both ways

lets ship some crap from Eagle uphill to Avimor so they can get their crap plant on line. With the rich poop coming out of Eagle, the Avimor trees would be 100' in a matter of months! As an added incentive, we could place a special portable collection unit outside Eagle City Hall, that particular BS would stimulate the re-growth of every pine needle lost to fires, in SW Idaho, this year in about 8 days.

And where...

is YOUR drain plug ;-)

Bravo....UOWNIT....

My sentiments exactly. Your elloquience and idea's are first rate.

Way to go!

Making the developers find solutions, not the taxpayer funded agencies - what a concept. Bieter for Governor!

No Thanks

Idaho already has an idiot governor. I do agree though that Avimor should have had a clear plan in place for sewage treatment. If the plan was to ship it to Boise for treatment, I have a hard time believing that Mayor Bieter wasn’t aware of that plan until now. The DEQ agreement for waste water treatment is a “BIG” part of the preliminary plan process and approval. Avimor has become Mayor Bieter’s personal war.

It's....

about ready it hit the fan

Once again...

local governments are doing it backwards. Make the developers build out the infratructure first THEN start building homes! When will they ever learn and who will pay the price? you and me.

Once again

Bieter is the last one to the party! If he knew about this debacle, he is lying to us,Again! If he didn't know about it, he sure as hell should have!
It is incredible to believe that the total planning process could take place and the chief executive officer of the city designated to receive the "leavings" from a development that most don't want to begin with, would be "unaware" of the plan. If anyone deserves the credit for bringing this to the light of day, it would be Dave Frazier at the Boise Guardian. Certainly not Bieter!
So, which is it Bieter? Are you lying or just incompetent?

Then again...

...I find it even more incredulous that neither the planning staff at Ada County Development Services nor the Ada County Commissioners were wind of this before they approved this development. And what were the developers thinking? That this would just magically solve itself by Boise not realizing that poop runs downhill? I think I'd rather invest with the other kind of craps...

They haven't asked Bieter yet.

Bieter has always opposed this development. If you read the article, it says they haven't even asked the City yet, so how could Bieter be either lying or incompetent about this? Avimor has several other options besides Boise's sewage plant. In fact, think Bieter is doing a good job by telling them to jack it.

Cyclops, your guy lost

so get over it and drop the invective. In fact, Jim Tibbs provided some nice comments to Mayor Bieter at the swearing in ceremony at the Depot, and as I recall Tibbs was on board with the city contesting this ill-advised Avimor development in court. So time for you to move on and end the negative attitude.

And like you pointed out, the Boise Guardian is the tip sheet on this topic, but it's the Idaho Statesman who is the last to the party to get around reporting on this since the Mayor and Council are already at work to prohibit Avimor shipping us the waste.

City Being Petty

The amount of sewage for 40-80 homes is insignificant to the Boise WWTP's. Avimor is going to find a place to dispose of their sewage regardless of the City. Also, Avimor will have their own sewage plant. It just does not function well at low volumes.

I don't see the City trying to stop development iside it's own boundaries. Come on Bieter be a good neighbor.

Boise Treatment System

WOW!! Seems to me that Boise Waste Water Treatment System was partially funded by FEDERAL TAX dollars. I am not a citizen of the "State of BOISE" or under the penalship of Zar Bieter but it seems to me that they might have a lawsuit on their hands if they show predudice over one septic tank and not another. I hope the Zar doesn't form a militia and try to take over his neighbors.

It's entirely possible

It's entirely possible Bieter knew nothing of this. Avimor is not a City of Boise issue, necessarily.

It is, however, an Eagle and Ada County issue, and certainly politicos in those offices should have known.

Known?

I'm sure they knew, but the beloved Nancy Merrill and council let it in anyway! Thankfully she's gone now only to be replaced with a new pro-growth-bend-over-to-the-developers mayor Bandy. :-(

This is a great metaphor

The infrastructure in the rest of the valley will have to deal with all of the negative impacts from this development. We all will pay while the developer makes money unless someone makes them take care of all of their own "crap." Bieter is right on this one.

IdahoJoe

Right on Joe! This is trickle down economics, guess who gets trickled on ;)

Our Mayor is right and thinking about his city. He should not have to worry about what the outside communities that do nothing for Boise do with their waste.

I am inclined to agree with you, IdahoJoe

This will get worked out though. Luckily there are no homes built yet. AND in the end, money will talk. Most of us will take someone else's crap for enough money.

So where do you stick all this added waste?

Go figure, the issue concerning the added waste generated from this new development was thought about months ago, but they still push forward in the name of progress and greed. Nothing is more upscale than owning a million dollar home with its own built in septic tank.
Another issue to consider is Highway 55. On the 4th of July and Labor Day it is a mess with bumper to bumper traffic. The location of this new upscale development will make every morning and afternoon look like the 4th of July. If that

Air pollution

I have to say I'm all for the city of Boise telling Avimor to F-off, but the smart thing to do would be to just accept the waste for a fee at the nearest treatment plant to the development. Making them truck it to Payette or (especially) Elmore county is just going to increase the wear on roads and add to the air pollution problem in the valley.

Heck, they could even come up with some charge that's MORE than the $56 cited in the article because the waste is coming from outside the city limits or something. This is an opportunity to Boise to make some money off these clowns and save the roads and the air at the same time.

Instead we're snubbing them (which I'm all for) at our own expense. What's that about not cutting off your own nose to spite your face?

Maybe it's

cutting off your nose to aviod the stench!

Oh you know!

Anyone that can afford to buy a house in Avimor well.... their S**T don't stink!
Right?

Heeheehee

heeheeheeheeheehee.....

No, screw 'em

We didn't want the sprawl project in the first place so there is no reason to take their money now and provide a fee for service. It's not worth quibbling over haul distances.

This story is strictly political

The reality of this story is that the sewage treatment plant that is owned and maintained with city money currently serves over 80,000 homes. It has capacity to serve well over 100,000 homes. Temporarily adding 80 homes to this demand is a non-factor. Mayor Beiter's stance on accepting sewage from a development outside of the city limits is purely political. This decision will increase traffic and lower air quality if septic waste needs to be transported any further than necessary. Air quality will be a continuing issue for this valley to deal with and Mayor Beiter certainly did not help this issue.

Sounds like.....

Sounds like a bucket of crap to me!

:)

Shadow Valley

Avimor=good fertilizer for the greens at shadow valley GC wouldn't you think? Sh!+ it there, I mean ship it there.

I agree with Elhefe

Is Mayor Beiter against Planned Communities, or just the ones outside his tax-base reach? If he keeps this attitude up, Avimore will fill-up pretty quick (that is, with people trying to move there :).

Most people who would like to get away from the traffic conjestion, residential over-crowding, crime, and the occasional 'political disfunction' of Boise, at least in the evening hours. Planned communities are here to stay and are light-years ahead of the old sub-division concept with respect to the environment structure and self-sufficient design.

The Boise treatment plant and, I am assuming, landfill were funded in part with Federal dollars. I believe that Beiter's mean-spirited last ditch attempt to get his diggs in, is both illegal and unethical. We're all members of ADA county, State of Idaho, & The United States. We share the benefits of tax dollars with our neighbors.

I would assume that within a few days he will check with his attorneys on the legality of his threat, reflect on the potential additional income, and have a revalation to accept the sewage 'Out of Good-will and cooperation'...

So, your s**t is our s**t?

If Bieter is so awful and these "planned" communities are so great, then move there yourself. And enjoy the forty minute ride home every time you want to come to civilization to see the Idaho Shakespeare Theater, an event at the Morrison Center or dinner at an actual restaurant. I live near 23rd and State and traffic is a NON ISSUE...I'm already there. Why aren't we thinking, like Bieter, whom you seem to despise, about building a denser core of housing near town? On the other hand, if you don't like what town has to offer, why are you complaining about traffic? What is it that you need to come to in to the dense part of town that makes you rail about traffic? Stay out there with your mosquitos and horseflies.

Right Al.

I knew the day would come when you could actully sell s**t.

I've tried Craigslist, eBay and flyers, even friends...

Man, I can't sell s**t for givin' it away!

HA!!!

Ain't it the truth!

Ship it to the Kibbie Dome!

The only way to fill it up!!

you guys dont get it

hello people who dont how growth works! i am so sorry i live in a state that has people mad at growth, and yet they probably still want their house to be worth more than it is! this is the way the cities grow and keep prospering and keeps your home values up...you dont want it to stop or else the cities die down and everyone leaves! big companies that develop come here to make money, yes, but do you also know it is helping your neighbor keep a paycheck? and long after they leave the locals still earn a living from these communities. most of these developers depend on the local subcontractors to help build these beautiful communities, and our state only reaps the rewards of the job well done...do we want homes and subdivisions done right the first time or not? you cant have small unappealing subdivisions and expect growth, it doesnt work that way....maybe the idahoans who have lived here all their life are not used to the change but if they want better schools better college programs and more money for our state they better not be so quick to hate on the developers, who at least seem to appreciate the land we have and want to keep it looking beautiful...maybe the complainers dont care if they live next door to people who have junk in the front of their house, no cc&r's, no sidewalks. i wasnt born here but i do appreciate idaho, the land the animals the traditions, and at least we have smart developers coming in here wanting to keep the integrity of our state instead of cookie cutter homes that are made cheaply and have no value or a beautiful play area that is also safe for your kids. are these complainers just jealous they are not getting a 'cut' in these planned communities? well i am here to say you are, everyone is in idaho, whether you are apart of it or not we all benefit from well planned homes and subdivisions, and yes along with that comes a price, but no one ever said nice things were free? i apologize to suncor and hope that the comments and the way some of the people here in idaho feel about them dont send them packing and putting their money somewhere else where it is appreciated. so many locals are hired by them and isnt that a good thing? these are idahoans who want to work period and keep this state in a flow of forward not backward, and if the mayor of boise wants to send a negative message to others about our state,keep doing what he is doing. he is in for a rude awakening when he finds other hotels and restaurants dont want to mess with him and back out or have no interest in boise or idaho. are we crazy when we say everyone leave, no more growth? instead of making new laws forbidding this or that why doesnt the mayor come up with a plan to keep growth coming but not without a plan to keep it at an even pace...seems like we were not thinking about that 5 years ago or complaining too much about the crazy growth then, and now we say no more? everyone who thinks the planned homes out on 55 or others are a bad idea need to go live in riverside or corona californis and see how those 'planned' communities turned out and then maybe you might be thanking suncor or m3 for picking us to put their money into, and yes they do get some help but if you saw all the money these developers do put into a nicely planned community, you may swallow you rharsh words and actually find out these people are no so bad.

allaboutidaho

thank you for your concise argument.

And by the way your basic understanding of economics is wrong. If more and more homes are built (supply) that contributes to LOWER prices in the market for existing homes. If you don't believe me look at a miserable place like the Bay Area. Lousy old homes sell for 7 figures in part because the powers that be don't allow much new construction (High demand/low supply)...thereby driving up the cost of existing homes. I'm not suggesting this but if no new homes were built for 5 years do you think the price of existing homes would go up, down, or stabilize? They would appreciate quickly. So it's fine that you, the RE agents, the mortgage brokers, and construction subs make money. For the rest of us it is a different equation.

Second how does building homes make land beautiful? If that is the case we should be putting condo's in Yellowstone.

lousy old homes

i was talking about the subdivision as a whole, we need the nicer ones, for just the reasons you mention, i am not saying build and build till there is nothing left (which we would never even come close to with the bay area or seattle or even san diego) but build it good, strong and with a good company or yes you will have too many homes selling for way more than they are worth,(the above mentioned home you were speaking of) that is the plan the cities need to stand by, not shut it all out, you can't.
building is going to happen regardless if you are against it or not, so would you want a beautiful community that at least isnt an eye sore and blends with land or do you want the cheapest builder in idaho on the rolling hills with their box homes side by side waited to be rented, i guess we should be lucky it wasnt the latter......thanks for your insight though, have been in the construction world all my 40 years and know that if the building stops, lots of other things follow....stay positive

lousy old homes

I'm really not anti-growth at all but imho we should concentrate construction in the flatlands where services exist. There's room here for well over a million people.

Building on farmland vs. foothills...

Saw a geographer on TV a few years ago commenting on Cole's save the foothills plan. He said that from his view we should be building on the foothills and saving the irrigated farmland. The farmland was vital for food production and the resulting economic activity, and not easily replaced. Whereas the foothills didn't hold much value other than looking at them.

Disclaimer: I live on some of that former farmland; couldn't afford the hillside home.

Building on farmland vs. foothills...

The farmland that lies within incorporated cities can all be built on and we won't see one tiny thing missing from our local Albertson's. We don't have to be dependent on local farming. As the farmers sell they become wealthy (good for them) the land houses new families, and our food supply will be just fine.

food prices

gocatchem, have you noticed the price of food lately? Some of it is Albertsons greed, some of it is market speculation, and some of it is because of fuel costs. But the truth is, the price increases are driven by worldwide demand. Despite record harvests, food reserves are at record lows. While we may see it as just an increase in the price of groceries, someone in another country may now be starving. With record fuel prices making it expensive to transport food, and the demands for crops to make fuels and feed an increasing population; you would be a fool to suggest taking farmland out of production.

agree

Let's build up the desert wasteland that is the foothills, and look down on productive, gravity irrigated farmland.

no new homes built for 5 years

the above statement is not even reality, sad to say only in a perfect world. you have to have building it cannot shut down or there is a trickle affect in all markets that affect our state, and no i dont make money as an agent or broker, just a sub who earns a paycheck like you and can make his house payment every month thank goodness but it has slowed down and already seeing a great halt in idaho, so who knows maybe i may not make my feb payment, has happened before and could happen again, the life of construction, but whatever line of work you are in you want it to prosper as i also want to see my neighbor do as well? we all live here together, dont we all want to see everyone succeed or just the ones in your equation? it's too bad people seem to want to fight about who has it worse or the land issue, i think most everyone who lives here lives here because of the beautiful hills and land......and it was the people too.....

no new homes built for 5 years

Please read what was written. No plan or suggestion was proferred to shut-down all new construction for 5 years. It was used as a device to show a hole in your post. Totally shutting down new construction for 5 years will never happen and should never happen....but.....as for your statement that you have to have building... that is not true. Communities do enforce limited duration no growth and/or unlimited duration limits on growth and do just fine. I do understand that this is how you make a buck so it threatens your mortgage payment. I get that. But thinking of the good of the TV overall and not just the construction/RE/mortgage people some temporary limit on growth (not total abolisment) would benefit the greater number of people.

boom & bust

There are many people who work in construction, real estate, etc. who don't save for a rainy day. During the booms they live large, then when things slow down they start missing payments. The crooks are the real estate agents, 6% for not doing much--probably make more on one house than the construction workers make a year.

Or else your want to have the same...

lame arguments they've been having in Portland for 34.7 million years or since the GEICO Caveman wanted to build a new cavern for his den.