The health care speech: video, Joe Wilson and an open thread

You've probably seen most of this, but a good quick clip from President Obama's health care reform speech Wednesday night:


A short-attention-span viewer's guide:

• During Obama's "death panels" remarks, at about the 1:27 mark, there is a Sen. Jim Risch sighting. The Idaho Republican, seated next to Sen. Orrin Hatch, R-Utah, doesn't look too convinced.

• At the 2:13 mark, we hear the now-infamous "You lie" from Rep. Joe Wilson, R-S.C. Congratulations to Wilson, who has now become the made-for-YouTube LeGarrette Blount of American politics. (And what is it about South Carolina politicians lately? Oh well, at least it's some other state).

Wilson has since apologized: you know, like Blount did.

But really, what can you say about Wilson? Are we ever going to get back to civil discourse? I hope so, and suspect you share that hope. And, if not, maybe you're just a mouth-breathing moron.

In the spirit of better dialogue, I hope you'll comment here. If you have your own reactions or questions about the speech, I'd like to see them. We're writing an editorial on this topic for Friday.

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Here is something that I

Here is something that I don't think a lot of the Union
employees realize with regard to the public option part of the health care reform...If it goes through, it will just be a matter of time before companies (bcbs etc) get out of the health insurance business, they will not be able to compete....so, if your current company uses them for coverage, guess what? You will be on the Govt plan too! Good luck!

Does socialist know the meaning of the American dream?

Webster's which we all grew up using all thorugh education controled by government defines it as an American social ideal. Most people think it's all about owning a home I suppose but how does that differ when our representatives who accepted $64 million from AIG & the rest they bailed out, stopped public debate into whether derivatives were a risk to the world finacial system? The Statesman printe dthe three day series but that wa sit, no more to investigate there, no more to be said?

When Larry Craig was up agin the wall in the MN head, th Statesman was all about speding time & moeny to investigate but when it comes to the country being robbed by our mis-representatives, don't have the resources? That's not odd? Is it any wonder the paper is gong broke, if they're afraid to report or investigate news they copied from the AP wire, why not get a real job?

By calling Obama a socialist, are republicans calling Obama the American dream?

Does anybody know why unions came to be? Didn't have anything to do with no healthcare, abuse by employers, long hours, low pay, & our representation NOT representing US as working class in the first place.

Who is all about busting unions? GOP? I grew up in NE just 30 miles away from a pork plant, union, which paid appoximately $12 an hour in the late seventies. The workers, Americans, took pay cuts down to approxomatey $8.50 an hour before they said no more cuts. The plant closed the door & brought in illegal immigrants. This hapened all over the nation. Ever since Vietnam or sooner, our mis-representatives have been making bank breaking US! Not just one poarty, both, & you'll never hear one of them suggest campaign finance except in passing, special interest as Obama did in the address. If any of them say anything, they're out! How many of us would walk away form million sor open the big mouth knowing it may get you killed?

Next we have free trade, China always on the $ end of trade, yet our represnetatives can't make enough trips to China for trade? We have poison, sheetrock, dog food, toothpaste, & we promote slave labor in China which is in competition for oil which thanks to WY2K bush & his war in Iraq drove up the price of everything we buy. Busted houshold budgets to DC standards, in the red, exposed the crime in derivatives & our mis-representatives bailed out the crooks, their partners in crime through campaign finance. I've suggest people ra dthe Franklin Cover-up by John DeCamp buyt I know how many have, 0, not one person in this country wants to know the truth about why we're trillion in debt, all they want is the easy way out, easy this & easy that.

We learned absolutely nothing from the banking scandals of the 1980s, let the crooks get by with it then & now again.

How do we suggest that Joe Wislon out of slave state SC, would suggest this health care plan would pay to insure illegal immigrants without asking the union busting GOP how they aren't responsible to begin with when they bust unions, putting Americans out of work, holding down wages, & taking US taxpyaers out of the insurance pool? They promote dillegal immigration as long as I can remmeber & I'm 52 years old. My father in-law was in the military, Reno, 1950s & told me they used to round up illegals until they had a bus load, haul them to Mexico, & illegaals would be back before the bus.

Unions are their own worst enemy but they had contracts no differently than bonuses handed out by the crooks on Wall Street & banks. How is it we don't treat Wall Street the same as we treat unions? How is it our represnettaives took millions from auto makers for years & the reason for US auto makers going broke a direct result of our mis-representaion promoting free trade? Bailed out auto makers & then had to promote cash for clunkers to make the auto bailout look like it's working. How many of the cars bought will be repossed due to lost jobs because of illegal immigration & free trade giving US jobs away.

The problems auto makers have is perpetual, same as the restof the nation, like meat packers who used to make a living wage for jobs republicans suggest we won't do so they promote illegal immigration. WY2K bush was on national TV suggesting Americans won't do these jobs!

I know from life experience this is a lie, I did those jobs 30 years ago when they paid a living wage, but look at US now. I've walked the fields, stood in & shoveled the crap, hauled the bales, milked cows, slopped the hogs, & did all kinds of jobs that obviously paid a living wage 30 year ago.

Does anybody believe Joe Wislon's lie wasn't planned, scripted same as town hall meeting? Obama called them on it, how embarassing it must have been to be caught on the state of the nation address? Does anybopdy in this nation believe any of our problems aren't the result of our mis-representaion through campaign finance? Why do they hand all those millions to our representatives to get elected? Both parties, not just one or the other, their horse can't lose in a two horse race. We lose either way because both parties fail to the point we vote the other in, it's a cycle of failure at taxpayer expense & for whatever reason we never catch on.

It's like all star wrestling, bad guys, good guys, & in the end they have your $ because we get all whipped up into a he said, she said, yada, yada, yada.

Does anybody ever ask why auto makers union contracts, pay & health care became the probllem they have leading to breaking the comnpanies? When they negociated contracts things weren't quite the same, health care costs have gone up, at the same time retired auto workers need more health care, more $$$$$. Add in illegal immigration as Joe Wilson would have US believe responsble but without accepting responsibility for promoting illegal immigratioin or busting unions! It's the same with every industry but union contracts locked in while the rest of US lost more everyday. We absorbed costs more than unions due to contracts & people blame unions & workers rather than the real problem, our mis-representatives.

Who pays millions handed over through campaign finance, CEOs, lawyers, accountants, & lobbysist who used to be on our payroll, fine salary, retirement, & health care? Does anybody believe contributors who received billions of our $ did, like defense contractors, who representatives then invest in while promoting war for years, really pay the millions to get our representatives elected? Millions paid to lobbyists who already made millions as reresentatives & corporation are now going to be allowed to buy our representation even more so thanks to judges put in place by representaives in the pocket & bed with contributors.

We the People paid every dime of campaign finance, lobbyists, CEOs, lawyers, accountants, & that is why we havce all the problems we do, trillions in debt. We have been taken by our mis-representaives through campaoign finance! Madoff was nothing compared t the terrorist on our payroll in DC.

We had them all together last night & should have been there to put bars up so they couldn't get back out into society to finish US off!

Every problem we have is a direct result of our mis-representatives taking $ from contributors while they pass our $ back & forth like bad notes from bank to bank, making billions which has turned into trillion we carry as debt.

Do any of our representatives who hand out tax cuts to contributors ask if those contributors use the infrastructure to produce & move their product? Roads, electricty, rail, water, air? Our infrastructure is $2 trillion in need of repair & upgrade, yet our representatives who have known this for years, accept millions, hand out billions, & tax cuts we absorb as individuals who are expected to drive 70% of the economy buying the product contributors produce?

Does any of this make sense? As far as I can tell the only part that adds up is trillions in debt. A good chunk of change from the stimulus is going to infrastructure but I don't hear anybody saying what I just pointed out. It's all Obama's fault according to republcians but not one person is asking why our representatives handed out all these tax cuts when they all knew we needed the $ for infrastructure! Why would our representatives leave out the little details of why our infrastructure is trillions in need, received a D or D- for years by the American Society of Civil Engineers? They're making millions of $ at our expense, both parties, & their partners in crime through campaign finance!

Why aren't we as individuals asking our representatives, like Otter, who was accepting $4500 of our $ to live in his own house while trying to raise fuel & vehicle registration, to pay for raods? Why aren't we asking his appointee in the tax commission, {after a whistle blower, Stan Howland let US know the tax commission lets corporations off for millions,} while he suggests corporations hire accountants heavy into tax knowledge, can't be bullied, but conviniently leave out the part where they contribute to Otter & the rest of our millionaire mis-representatives. Otter had Lowe fired from the transportaion & it was made clear she wouldn't hand over contracts to otter contribuotrs. Oh sure it wasn't otter who fired her or said no little girl is going to run yada, yada, yada, but only a fool would believe anything different.

This two party joke controlled through campaign finance is responsible for every problem we have, why the American people allow themsleves to be divided, & robbed through the process is nothing short of amazing.

I have a petition for full finacial disclosure by all our representatives & family on www.nextrevolution.net but you won't find the American people signing on to that, they'd rather be made the fool, played against each other in this BS we call representation. Doesn't say much for a country built on the foundation Ameirca is. Why everybody is crying about socialism or even suggest the Declaration & Constitution when they refuse to do anything but promote the status quo is a mistery. We're finished as a nation, nothing but a lie, too foolish to realize or do anything about it. We dishonor all who sacrificed so we could be free, have national holidays that are noting more than a paid day off because we allow this two party joke to rip US off, manipulate US as individuals to do their bidding in bashing the other party while they laugh.

The two parties have US, the united states divided, & that is the first step in terrorist winning. We're almost there, the Chinese flag will soon be proudly flying over the White House, repubicans & demcorats will still be blaming each other? How can the people be so easily taken for so much over such a long period of time?

Living Example of the American Dream - Hugh Hefner

Well, that's more like the American wet dream...but I'd bear that burden.

Yep, living with hotties, separated for 12 yrs, FINALLY DIVORCED

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There is no life in Idaho...it is a mirror site on god's server. You were dreaming but it is over. Go to your residence and await our commands and THEN we will restore control...

If socialist liveth in America, methinks they doth indeed...

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There is no life in Idaho...it is a mirror site on god's server. You were dreaming but it is over. Go to your residence and await our commands and THEN we will restore control...

Shocking and Disappointing

Rep. Wilson's comments were clearly out of line, but probably not surprising from a GOP politician from a racist backwater like South Carolina. All of that aside, he seems to have forgotten good manners, assuming he ever possessed any, about cordial southern hospitality to guests in one's house.

The dirty little secret is that.....

Wilson is correct. If the Statesman intends to write an editorial on this, they owe it to subscribers like me to report on the Congressional Research Services (CRS) report that House bill 3200 will allow illegal aliens to get taxpayer funded health care through two loopholes in the bill. The CRS is the research arm for the U.S. Senate. Their report states HR 3200 contains no restrictions on non citizens, here legally or illegally, temporarily or permanently, from participating in the Exchange (tax payer funded health care). Additionally, their is no mechanism in the bill to preclude illegals from getting "affordability credits" to subsidize the purchase of health insurance. This benefit is paid for by U.S. citizens. These loopholes are not in the bill by accident. The House Ways and Means Committee was asked to remove/clarify these and they refused - on two separate occasions. Now the question becomes: Does the Statesman and other media have an obligation to report these findings by the CRS to its subscribers or will their editorial seek to mis-inform the public as a means to advance a personal agenda?

Not exactly...go to the source, quit listening to Hannity's

interpretation.

http://assets.opencrs.com/rpts/R40773_20090825.pdf

Please note that this is a user submitted document, as these documents are not always fully released while the legislation is being considered.

Obama's healthcare speech

I thought he hit it out of the park. Terrific speech, and he answered the questions of anyone with the ears to listen. The CNN truth check determined that illegals would NOT be covered by this bill, though resident aliens would have to have insurance just like everyone else.

Lies

In one breath, Obama claims that he is welcome to ideas from both sides of the aisle, and then in the next he says the plan MUST include a government option. This is why emotions are so high. How do you combat someone who claims to be open to new ideas and promotes a public image as such, but really is not open-minded? When someone presents an opposing idea that Obama doesn't like, that person is labeled as being unreasonable and against poor uninsured Americans when if fact just by presenting an alternative idea proves that they have taken such an issue to heart and are looking for a solution. If they were for the status quo, they would just do nothing. Ultimately, it is one thing to say you are open-minded, it is quite another to actually BE open-minded.

So, open minded...like Republican Senator Mike Enzi?

Uhhh huh...

"It's not where I get them to compromise, it's what I get them to leave out," Enzi said Monday, according to the Billings Gazette.

GOP union busting while promoting illegal immigration!

How does anyone suggest after promoting illegal immigrtaion & union busting, that democrats are going to pay the health care of illegals as if we aren't already paying for better health care than we have as Americans?

Is Joe Wilson for real? Any republican, any American who is all about busting unions & promoting illegal immigration, doesn't see the results of their actions, then blame others for the results of their actions, must be nuts!

Can this guy & the rest of America be that dumb or is it all part of the mis-representatioin ripping US off through campaign finance?

Insurance companies

I find it amusing that the same people who say the US Government is inept and cannot possibly manage an adequate public option, are same folks who state that a public option would force insurance companies out of the health care business because they would be unable to compete. Can't have it both ways.

Earlier this year these same bloggers complained that if the auto companies couldn't compete they deserved to go out of business. Ah...the difference is clear :)

They also like to throw out the 'faceless bureaucrat' scenario..

"Do you want a government bureaucrat making decisions about your healthcare?"

As opposed to an overpaid CEO trying to ensure he gets a nice 6 figure bonus?
"We need to step up denials and hope they don't appeal. That way when our payouts decrease, we'll be more profitable and I'll get my bonus."

Do you really want to trust decisions about your health based solely on GREED?

The Federal Government gave us ......

the compassion of the IRS and
the efficiency of the Post Office
The Fed can make your health care decisions, I choose to make my own!

Post office is very efficient... and cheap.

Sorry if you don't like to pay your taxes and think that when people charged with collecting them come calling they are 'heartless'. Actually they are just doing their jobs.

With more debt than 1 department in the State of California.

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There is no life in Idaho...it is a mirror site on god's server. You were dreaming but it is over. Go to your residence and await our commands and THEN we will restore control...

The Federal Government also gave us...

USGS,ACOE,BOR,CDC,FAA,NIH,Coast Guard,Copyright Office,Secret Service, on and on, on and on. They do some things very, very well.

Joe Wilson is okay. He's just really STUPID right now.

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There is no life in Idaho...it is a mirror site on god's server. You were dreaming but it is over. Go to your residence and await our commands and THEN we will restore control...

Joe Wilson

Joe Wilson is ok...just raised over $600,000 for his opponent in one day.

Hell, that person owes beer and a BBQ then!

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There is no life in Idaho...it is a mirror site on god's server. You were dreaming but it is over. Go to your residence and await our commands and THEN we will restore control...

Kevin, hope you didn't have anything to do with that piece

of...., with that opinion piece on the front page talking about the public option. That is the most inane piece of editorial garbage I have ever seen rendered by the 'editorial board' at this paper. Next time, don't let the author watch Faux news before writing. Teh stoopid tends to accumulate and gum up the cerebral machinery.

McClatchy is supposed to have better ammo but what's this?

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There is no life in Idaho...it is a mirror site on god's server. You were dreaming but it is over. Go to your residence and await our commands and THEN we will restore control...